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PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:54 pm 
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 Post subject: errancy and cancer
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 3:03 pm 
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I wonder.

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 Post subject: Re: Shock and Awe
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 3:16 pm 
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Kerostasis wrote:
Boss Out of Town wrote:
I'll note that most poor eyesight is not called by anything resembling disease. Just random genetic variation in the shape of the eyeball. The spell would not necessarily recognize that as something to be corrected.


Granted, bad eyesight isn't a disease, but her breathing problems were almost certainly caused the same way--genetic defect in the shaping of her organs.

Now, the genetic defect may have made her more susceptible to lung disease, so I suppose she could have had both at the same time--but in that case the healing spell would still have to heal the genetic defect as well as the disease, or the disease would simply return after a few weeks anyway. So I think we can assume this spell was designed to repair inherent defects, not just diseases. It just wasn't targetted correctly. =)


Dr Mario- I mean, Ian wrote:
Sorry, I completely forgot about about your eyesight. And so it only got partially fixed up by the residual effects of that spell, I guess.


@ Boss in agreement with Kerostasis.


bellofthedamned wrote:
And also, DAMN YOU, POE! I don't want to like Ian!!! Yet, here he is, healing people, instead of going all 'splodey headed and massacring the innocent. I could like him if he was a little bit evil, but no, he's just so good.


Look, the way I see it... at least he's not Shinji Ikari. In this case, that's good enough for me.

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Yep, he fucked her good. :-)


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 3:54 pm 
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I don't think Poe having had cancer has that big of a role to play in ES. For one thing, he's completely unwilling to discuss it or what he went through to get over it, even with me. He's not going to make it a major part of anything he writes, precisely because then he'd be required to talk about it, or even to think about it. He's chosen to shut the door on that part of his life very firmly, so I doubt you'll be seeing any inspiring childhood cancer survival stories from him any time soon.

To me, Errantcy seems to be more like the host of allergies, auto-immune diseases, physical deformities, and psychological disorders which are increasingly popping up in humanity today. Those are all things you're pretty much born with or not, even if they only become apparent later in your life. Cancer, on the other hand, is something that happens to you, even if there's a genetic predisposition towards it.

-_-'

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 Post subject: Re: Shock and Awe
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 4:27 pm 
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Gwyon wrote:
Look, the way I see it... at least he's not Shinji Ikari. In this case, that's good enough for me.

I'm not so sure about that. Lets look at the evidence.

We have an angsty, self-pity infested man-bitch barren of even a single male physical or mental trait. He would be getting sexed up by a light-haired crazy chick, who is obviously the man of the relationship, if circumstances would die down for five minutes. He has intense hate of his remaining parent. Oh, yeah. And he is destined to end the fucking world.

Hate to tell you this, but Ian is Shinji.


As for Poe and cancer, my only thought is that his past is coming out. Bitterness towards the sick illogic that drives this world drips from his every pore and he seems to have built up some form of grim acceptance that the world is going to eventually find a new and novel way to fuck him in every existing orifice (and a few new ones) if he just waits long enough. He doesn't intentionally try to use these themes, but they work their way into his art nonetheless.

God rolls his big, magic dice and... whoops. Critical failure. You, you, and you. Ebola! And you, yes you are born with your intestines on the outside. The doctors can cure it, but the sideeffect of the treatment is... Ebola! Why? Why not!

Enjoy your little meaningless lives... or not.
Times up and, since you did the paperwork wrong, you go to hell!

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 Post subject: Re: Shock and Awe
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 5:07 pm 
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Labrat wrote:
He would be getting sexed up by a light-haired crazy chick, who is obviously the man of the relationship, if circumstances would die down for five minutes.

For Ian, you're obviously referring to Meji. For Shinji, it looks to me like you somehow combined Rei and Asuka. (Not a bad idea, I admit...)


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 5:14 pm 
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Imp-Chan wrote:
I don't think Poe having had cancer has that big of a role to play in ES. For one thing, he's completely unwilling to discuss it or what he went through to get over it, even with me. He's not going to make it a major part of anything he writes, precisely because then he'd be required to talk about it, or even to think about it. He's chosen to shut the door on that part of his life very firmly, so I doubt you'll be seeing any inspiring childhood cancer survival stories from him any time soon.

To me, Errantcy seems to be more like the host of allergies, auto-immune diseases, physical deformities, and psychological disorders which are increasingly popping up in humanity today. Those are all things you're pretty much born with or not, even if they only become apparent later in your life. Cancer, on the other hand, is something that happens to you, even if there's a genetic predisposition towards it.

-_-'


But I imagine that Errant Story is a world Poe would have envisioned. A world where maybe a god or a hero would come heal him. I think that's why I read it so avidly. I was constantly sick as a little girl, in and out of the hospital, and finally a bone marrow transplant. My daddy would bring my comic books to read, lol. I remember thinking I'd like a hero to come and take all the pain away from me. I didn't really know much about God, so I prayed to superheroes that they would come and heal me.

I know that's probably lame to most people, but maybe Ian's that hero that people wish for, maybe that's where he's headed. It's just a silly little dream, but hey, even now, when I feel sick, I keep thinking, "Are you there, hero, waiting to come rescue me?"

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 Post subject: Re: Shock and Awe
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 6:30 pm 
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Labrat wrote:
We have an angsty, self-pity infested man-bitch barren of even a single male physical or mental trait.

Damn, that's a nasty world you live in. Glad I didn't grow up there. Great flow of language, though.

Leah and Ian, although they both grew up in the same impoverished village, both seem very well educated. Riley, a lot less so. Since this village/region is a haven for half-elves who would otherwise might be living in more bountiful climes, I expect they might also be preserving some of the books and other lore that got otherwise lost in the war. For home schooling, and all. Explains why Ian would know what an archeologist is, at any rate.

Anyhow, Santuriel could be the home of some very interesting people. Pity the Elves are likely to burn it out before the end of the story.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 8:13 pm 
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A thing about the healing, Its well known that eyesight can get pretty bad over time, and get worse. Its also been thought that her errantcy is being more likely to get the blood coughing thingy.

What if Ian has to heal someone every couple of months? And then what happens when he dies, and theres no one left to heal the errants?

"Look on my works, ye Mighty, and despair!"

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 Post subject: Re: Shock and Awe
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 9:22 pm 
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BloodHenge wrote:
For Ian, you're obviously referring to Meji. For Shinji, it looks to me like you somehow combined Rei and Asuka. (Not a bad idea, I admit...)

It would make a damn fine piece of hentai or a halfway readable masturbatorial fanfic, thats for sure.

But technically you could only be sexxed up by Asuka... who would probably be breaking out sextoys and practices banned by the geneva convention, leaving you a broken and degraded shell of your former self. You would instinctively start crying whenever you masturbate and, by an odd twist, whenever you insert fish into your penguin. Rei, on the other hand, is essentially a fully poseable sexdoll... close your eyes and think of England incarnate. And, being an angsty man-bitch, nothing is ever going to happen. Might have better luck with the creepy, floaty clones though... they always look so happy.

Boss Out of Town wrote:
Damn, that's a nasty world you live in. Glad I didn't grow up there. Great flow of language, though.

Its called the midwest. Still better than goddamn New Jersey though.
I hold that state in great esteem. Darwinism has already killed off the weak there.

Boss Out of Town wrote:
Leah and Ian, although they both grew up in the same impoverished village, both seem very well educated. Riley, a lot less so.

Riley doesn't seem to me either dumb or unedjumacated. She just tends to do things without thinking about the matter first. She is a little like Torg from Sluggy Freelance... but enboobened.
...
Which again makes my porn wishlist get a wee bit longer.

Boss Out of Town wrote:
Anyhow, Santuriel could be the home of some very interesting people. Pity the Elves are likely to burn it out before the end of the story.

Ah, yes. And give Ian the perfect reason to return thousands of years of genocide to the elves in a single night.
Hell, if we piss Ian off enough he is likely to de-orbit the moon and give all of us a really bad day.

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 Post subject: Re: Shock and Awe
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 9:44 pm 
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Kerostasis wrote:
Boss Out of Town wrote:
I'll note that most poor eyesight is not called by anything resembling disease. Just random genetic variation in the shape of the eyeball. The spell would not necessarily recognize that as something to be corrected.

Granted, bad eyesight isn't a disease, but her breathing problems were almost certainly caused the same way--genetic defect in the shaping of her organs.

Now, the genetic defect may have made her more susceptible to lung disease, so I suppose she could have had both at the same time--but in that case the healing spell would still have to heal the genetic defect as well as the disease, or the disease would simply return after a few weeks anyway. So I think we can assume this spell was designed to repair inherent defects, not just diseases. It just wasn't targetted correctly. =)

Da probbem iss, genetic variation is not the same thing as a "defect." There is no perfect body design for anything grown from DNA and amino acids, just a a range of results, most differentiated only by being better adapted to certain environments than others.

In the case of eyesight, Astigmatism isn't necessarily a major defect for an illiterate peasant farmer, and far-sightedness could be an advantage for a hunter-gatherer. My short-sidedness would have increased my chances for an early death in a pre-industrial society, but I could also have lived to a decent age as "Thog the Squinter," the guy who grows a mean crop of barley but can't spot his own cow at a hundred paces.

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 Post subject: Re: Shock and Awe
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 9:58 pm 
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Labrat wrote:
Gwyon wrote:
Look, the way I see it... at least he's not Shinji Ikari. In this case, that's good enough for me.

I'm not so sure about that. Lets look at the evidence.

We have an angsty, self-pity infested man-bitch barren of even a single male physical or mental trait. He would be getting sexed up by a light-haired crazy chick, who is obviously the man of the relationship, if circumstances would die down for five minutes. He has intense hate of his remaining parent. Oh, yeah. And he is destined to end the fucking world.

Hate to tell you this, but Ian is Shinji.


As for Poe and cancer, my only thought is that his past is coming out. Bitterness towards the sick illogic that drives this world drips from his every pore and he seems to have built up some form of grim acceptance that the world is going to eventually find a new and novel way to fuck him in every existing orifice (and a few new ones) if he just waits long enough. He doesn't intentionally try to use these themes, but they work their way into his art nonetheless.

God rolls his big, magic dice and... whoops. Critical failure. You, you, and you. Ebola! And you, yes you are born with your intestines on the outside. The doctors can cure it, but the sideeffect of the treatment is... Ebola! Why? Why not!

Enjoy your little meaningless lives... or not.
Times up and, since you did the paperwork wrong, you go to hell!


Thank god you're saying Shinji, and *not* Shiunji.

www.sexylosers.com , anyone?


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 10:12 pm 
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Don't you insult Shiunji, damn you! The man is a hero to necrophiles everywhere!


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 Post subject: Re: Shock and Awe
PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 10:17 pm 
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Boss Out of Town wrote:
..Stuff...

In the case of eyesight, Astigmatism isn't necessarily a major defect for an illiterate peasant farmer, and far-sightedness could be an advantage for a hunter-gatherer. My short-sidedness would have increased my chances for an early death in a pre-industrial society, but I could also have lived to a decent age as "Thog the Squinter," the guy who grows a mean crop of barley but can't spot his own cow at a hundred paces.


I'm short sighted (albeit, I don't wear glasses 99% of the time, because I'm not seriously impaired) but I find certain tasks, like machining and tailoring, tabletop modelling and other things like that to be easy.

I can inspect my product as closeup as I want, gaining full advantage of light reflecting from various imperfections (accidental scratches or loose threads).

Sure it's a bitch when I'm trying watch TV or whatever, but what the hell. I got a good bonus out of it.

Consider the microscope.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 10:35 pm 
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Same here... only I am fucking blind when looking at anything farther than a foot and a half from my head.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 10:58 pm 
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Labrat wrote:
Same here... only I am fucking blind when looking at anything farther than a foot and a half from my head.

Don't worry, we aren't doing anything out here that will harm you. Much.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 11:54 pm 
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Well, thats better than me at least...I lose focus at nine inches.

But really, the difference between "variation" and "defect" is basically whatever society defines it to be. There's no absolute biological difference that would register bad eyesight as "variation" and bad lungshape as "defect". Given the low level of autonomy probably available to a magic spell, its most likely to just accept whatever Ian's definition of "defect" was while casting it.

...and given Ian's power level at the moment, he could probably define "being alive" as a "defect" and kill you with a healing spell if he wanted :lol:


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2007 1:39 am 
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Yorik wrote:
Don't you insult Shiunji, damn you! The man is a hero to necrophiles everywhere!


Yea well, I follow the path of Mike.

He's like a prophet for me, with the exception is still have enough moral fibre not to include my flatmates.

Disabled women, however... christ, the sorta freaky shit you can perform with them... I swear it's fantastic.

*snort* yea right.


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 Post subject: Re: Shock and Awe
PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2007 4:38 am 
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Labrat wrote:
Rei, on the other hand, is essentially a fully poseable sexdoll... close your eyes and think of England incarnate.

Plus, something I forgot when I made my earlier post: She's essentially a clone of Shinji's mother, which would shift that particular relationship (such as it would be...) decidedly away from the "vanilla" side of things.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2007 6:55 am 
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bellofthedamned wrote:
Imp-Chan wrote:
I don't think Poe having had cancer has that big of a role to play in ES. For one thing, he's completely unwilling to discuss it or what he went through to get over it, even with me. He's not going to make it a major part of anything he writes, precisely because then he'd be required to talk about it, or even to think about it. He's chosen to shut the door on that part of his life very firmly, so I doubt you'll be seeing any inspiring childhood cancer survival stories from him any time soon.

To me, Errantcy seems to be more like the host of allergies, auto-immune diseases, physical deformities, and psychological disorders which are increasingly popping up in humanity today. Those are all things you're pretty much born with or not, even if they only become apparent later in your life. Cancer, on the other hand, is something that happens to you, even if there's a genetic predisposition towards it.

-_-'


But I imagine that Errant Story is a world Poe would have envisioned. A world where maybe a god or a hero would come heal him. I think that's why I read it so avidly. I was constantly sick as a little girl, in and out of the hospital, and finally a bone marrow transplant. My daddy would bring my comic books to read, lol. I remember thinking I'd like a hero to come and take all the pain away from me. I didn't really know much about God, so I prayed to superheroes that they would come and heal me.

I know that's probably lame to most people, but maybe Ian's that hero that people wish for, maybe that's where he's headed. It's just a silly little dream, but hey, even now, when I feel sick, I keep thinking, "Are you there, hero, waiting to come rescue me?"


I was trying to see where the bits of the mystery lay. It appears that Poe may agree with Baudelaire: "je suis un autre." And sure, this is the stance, yet an artist's life is tangled with the weft and weave, wish-fulfillment etc, and connections can be leapt at. I wasn't simply suggesting that bits of life map directly to work, although I can be accused of that in my work to date, still things emerge in surprising ways. The role of the errants is a complex one. One of their roles I think is as victims of genocide and as such they could be seen by the elves as a "cancer" on their society. BTB I think Ian, as an errant, will go crazy towards the end and then start killing all sundry. Or something.

Somewhat reminiscent of "Flowers for Algernon"?

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