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PostPosted: Wed Nov 01, 2006 11:07 pm 
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Rakshasa wrote:
You just killed a score of cat-girls dressed in WWII paraphernalia by dragging racial traits into the discussion about a comic.

Every time a catgirl dies, god kills a catgirl.

The only reason they still exist is that there is a bit of a time delay and they breed like fuck.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 01, 2006 11:16 pm 
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DarkTemplar4ever wrote:
speaking of decapitation, does anyone think that Warrel's decap seems to be at a weird angle?

Hmmm . . . nope. The point of view, when Warrel was facing away from Jon and about to spear Sarine, had Sarine's head to his right. When he half-turned to block the bullet, he presented his left side to Sarine. She had her duress filber in her right hand when we last saw her, edge opposite her wrist.

My guess would be that she is pushing herself off the ground with her left hand and taking a backhand swing upward with her right. Depending on whether she has a spinal injury or not, her legs could be straight back or pulled up under her. In either case, Sarine's as strong as an ox and the blade will cut anything, so that awkward swing slices through Warrel's body in just the fashion illustrated.

On another note, the shadows across Jon's face in the lower panel suggest that he morphed into The Crow in between panels. Puzzling only because I've never read that comic and it shouldn't be the first thing that pops into my head.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2006 6:32 am 
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Labrat wrote:
Rakshasa wrote:
You just killed a score of cat-girls dressed in WWII paraphernalia by dragging racial traits into the discussion about a comic.

Every time a catgirl dies, god kills a catgirl.

The only reason they still exist is that there is a bit of a time delay and they breed like fuck.


People die when they are killed. -Emiya Shirou

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2006 10:52 am 
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That's a very intuitive quote you have there.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2006 11:59 am 
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Boss Out of Town wrote:
Tiamat wrote:
Anyway. I'm pretty sure Jon slammed that thing down across Sara's throat, or at the very least her collarbone. She's not gonna be able to time magic her way out of a lack of oxygen.

Hee . . . Looking at the arrangement of the hands in both panels, it appears that Jon, instead of just grabbing the dolan, wrenched it around clockwise. Sara unwisely refused to let go, so big brother spun her and her weapon in mid-air like a doll tied to a baton. Then he reversed his grip to throw his weight on the weapon and bring it down tight on her throat as she impacted on the floor.

I dimly recall that maneuver described as a good way to take out an attacking doberman, but it works on your little sister if she's small enough.


Ensigerum = doberman?
works for me.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2006 11:59 am 
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Boss Out of Town wrote:
Tiamat wrote:
Anyway. I'm pretty sure Jon slammed that thing down across Sara's throat, or at the very least her collarbone. She's not gonna be able to time magic her way out of a lack of oxygen.

Hee . . . Looking at the arrangement of the hands in both panels, it appears that Jon, instead of just grabbing the dolan, wrenched it around clockwise. Sara unwisely refused to let go, so big brother spun her and her weapon in mid-air like a doll tied to a baton. Then he reversed his grip to throw his weight on the weapon and bring it down tight on her throat as she impacted on the floor.

I dimly recall that maneuver described as a good way to take out an attacking doberman, but it works on your little sister if she's small enough.


Ensigerum = doberman?
works for me.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2006 1:36 pm 
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Skane wrote:
Well, this certainly leaves no question on the state of Warrel's spine compared to Sarine's. Go Jon, go.


Based on my reading of the angles, Red Shirt Warrel is likely going to have a spinal severe spinal injury in about one second. At the moment his upper lung, a few major blood vessels, and his windpupe are now severed. Also is right arm has been severed, and his right shoulder is about to be seperated from the rest of his body also.

I suppose he could "do the time warp again" off Sarine's blade and save his spine. Unfortunatly, I doubt even a time warping monk would have much time left with no blood returning to his heart but filling his lungs instead.

*Actually the law of relativity basicly states Warrel is dead. After all, even if he accelerates he still has the same amount of time within his 'time frame' to save himself.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2006 1:37 pm 
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Skane wrote:
Well, this certainly leaves no question on the state of Warrel's spine compared to Sarine's. Go Jon, go.


Based on my reading of the angles, Red Shirt Warrel is likely going to have a spinal severe spinal injury in about one second. At the moment his upper lung, a few major blood vessels, and his windpupe are now severed. Also is right arm has been severed, and his right shoulder is about to be seperated from the rest of his body also.

I suppose he could "do the time warp again" off Sarine's blade and save his spine. Unfortunatly, I doubt even a time warping monk would have much time left with no blood returning to his heart but filling his lungs instead.

*Actually the law of relativity basicly states Warrel is dead. After all, even if he accelerates he still has the same amount of time within his 'time frame' to save himself.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2006 1:40 pm 
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Alcona wrote:
Skane wrote:
Well, this certainly leaves no question on the state of Warrel's spine compared to Sarine's. Go Jon, go.


Based on my reading of the angles, Red Shirt Warrel is likely going to have a spinal severe spinal injury in about one second. At the moment his upper lung, a few major blood vessels, and his windpupe are now severed. Also is right arm has been severed, and his right shoulder is about to be seperated from the rest of his body also.

I suppose he could "do the time warp again" off Sarine's blade and save his spine. Unfortunatly, I doubt even a time warping monk would have much time left with no blood returning to his heart but filling his lungs instead.

*Actually the law of relativity basicly states Warrel is dead. After all, even if he accelerates he still has the same amount of time within his 'time frame' to save himself.

*watches with interest as yet another catgirl bites the bullet* :-P


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2006 1:53 pm 
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kerberos wrote:
Alcona wrote:
Skane wrote:
Well, this certainly leaves no question on the state of Warrel's spine compared to Sarine's. Go Jon, go.


Based on my reading of the angles, Red Shirt Warrel is likely going to have a spinal severe spinal injury in about one second. At the moment his upper lung, a few major blood vessels, and his windpupe are now severed. Also is right arm has been severed, and his right shoulder is about to be seperated from the rest of his body also.

I suppose he could "do the time warp again" off Sarine's blade and save his spine. Unfortunatly, I doubt even a time warping monk would have much time left with no blood returning to his heart but filling his lungs instead.

*Actually the law of relativity basicly states Warrel is dead. After all, even if he accelerates he still has the same amount of time within his 'time frame' to save himself.

*watches with interest as yet another catgirl bites the bullet* :-P


Alcona and Hubris, killing catgirls since 1994....

edit: Technically 12 catgirls have died during this thread...(Too much physics people! Too much Physics! Now stop killing catgirls and be nice :billnye: )


Last edited by Alcona on Thu Nov 02, 2006 2:11 pm, edited 4 times in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2006 2:10 pm 
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icekatze wrote:
hi hi

Or perhaps the Ensigerum isnt quite so awesome and totally unstoppable as they would like to believe, hence their leader's distaste for their decreased combat prowess. Perhaps that group of wraiths that got slaughtered, died because they panicked.

Who knows? Perhaps we're in for an explanation as soon as they get the heck out of dodge.


Yeah, I'm starting to think the Ensigerum is only at its best when they have the advantage of surprise or during one on one combat. Well, besides Imperatrix who practices against groups. Either way, I think whatever they do takes a LOT of focus so they're at their worst when they are either distracted or don't expect something coming.

As far as Sara, either she is
a) having some sort of internal struggle that's slowing her down
b) still a n00b in the Ensigerum and isn't as good as I thought (although she probably has a LOT of promise)


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2006 2:21 pm 
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It's a <i>double</i> double post. You don't see that every day!

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2006 7:05 pm 
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Alcona wrote:
Skane wrote:
Well, this certainly leaves no question on the state of Warrel's spine compared to Sarine's. Go Jon, go.


Based on my reading of the angles, Red Shirt Warrel is likely going to have a spinal severe spinal injury in about one second. At the moment his upper lung, a few major blood vessels, and his windpupe are now severed. Also is right arm has been severed, and his right shoulder is about to be seperated from the rest of his body also.


I think you're reading the motion of the blade backwards. Look at the motion lines from the tip of Sarine's sword down toward the lower right of the panel. Now reverse that motion. Also not the gash in Warrel's shirt running parallel to it. Sarine cut up and across from Warrel's left arm, across his torso (including spine), and is about the exit his body through his right shoulder.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2006 7:22 pm 
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Chronomancer wrote:
icekatze wrote:
hi hi

Or perhaps the Ensigerum isnt quite so awesome and totally unstoppable as they would like to believe, hence their leader's distaste for their decreased combat prowess. Perhaps that group of wraiths that got slaughtered, died because they panicked.

Who knows? Perhaps we're in for an explanation as soon as they get the heck out of dodge.


Yeah, I'm starting to think the Ensigerum is only at its best when they have the advantage of surprise or during one on one combat. Well, besides Imperatrix who practices against groups. Either way, I think whatever they do takes a LOT of focus so they're at their worst when they are either distracted or don't expect something coming.

As far as Sara, either she is
a) having some sort of internal struggle that's slowing her down
b) still a n00b in the Ensigerum and isn't as good as I thought (although she probably has a LOT of promise)


Note that Sarine's Alpha-strike from out of blade-range with total tactical surprise was one of the least effective moves of the fight. And Warrel certainly made enough cuts to kill off an entire squad. Numbers and tactical variables might not be all that decisive. Nah, I'm converting to and advocating the viewpoint that Sarine and Jon burned up all outstanding Karma from 3030-odd cumulative years of nice-guy assassin behavior. Highest attainable skill in their chosen vocation causing them to be in a position to benefit from a massive windfall of luck. Non-duplicatable feat given identical or even improved conditions.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2006 9:39 pm 
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normalphil wrote:
Chronomancer wrote:
icekatze wrote:
hi hi

Or perhaps the Ensigerum isnt quite so awesome and totally unstoppable as they would like to believe, hence their leader's distaste for their decreased combat prowess. Perhaps that group of wraiths that got slaughtered, died because they panicked.

Who knows? Perhaps we're in for an explanation as soon as they get the heck out of dodge.


Yeah, I'm starting to think the Ensigerum is only at its best when they have the advantage of surprise or during one on one combat. Well, besides Imperatrix who practices against groups. Either way, I think whatever they do takes a LOT of focus so they're at their worst when they are either distracted or don't expect something coming.

As far as Sara, either she is
a) having some sort of internal struggle that's slowing her down
b) still a n00b in the Ensigerum and isn't as good as I thought (although she probably has a LOT of promise)


Note that Sarine's Alpha-strike from out of blade-range with total tactical surprise was one of the least effective moves of the fight. And Warrel certainly made enough cuts to kill off an entire squad. Numbers and tactical variables might not be all that decisive. Nah, I'm converting to and advocating the viewpoint that Sarine and Jon burned up all outstanding Karma from 3030-odd cumulative years of nice-guy assassin behavior. Highest attainable skill in their chosen vocation causing them to be in a position to benefit from a massive windfall of luck. Non-duplicatable feat given identical or even improved conditions.


What? I've understood every post except this..


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2006 10:13 pm 
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Then you must further hone your geekenese.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2006 10:44 pm 
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Zherical wrote:
normalphil wrote:
Chronomancer wrote:
icekatze wrote:
hi hi

Or perhaps the Ensigerum isnt quite so awesome and totally unstoppable as they would like to believe, hence their leader's distaste for their decreased combat prowess. Perhaps that group of wraiths that got slaughtered, died because they panicked.

Who knows? Perhaps we're in for an explanation as soon as they get the heck out of dodge.


Yeah, I'm starting to think the Ensigerum is only at its best when they have the advantage of surprise or during one on one combat. Well, besides Imperatrix who practices against groups. Either way, I think whatever they do takes a LOT of focus so they're at their worst when they are either distracted or don't expect something coming.

As far as Sara, either she is
a) having some sort of internal struggle that's slowing her down
b) still a n00b in the Ensigerum and isn't as good as I thought (although she probably has a LOT of promise)


Note that Sarine's Alpha-strike from out of blade-range with total tactical surprise was one of the least effective moves of the fight. And Warrel certainly made enough cuts to kill off an entire squad. Numbers and tactical variables might not be all that decisive. Nah, I'm converting to and advocating the viewpoint that Sarine and Jon burned up all outstanding Karma from 3030-odd cumulative years of nice-guy assassin behavior. Highest attainable skill in their chosen vocation causing them to be in a position to benefit from a massive windfall of luck. Non-duplicatable feat given identical or even improved conditions.


What? I've understood every post except this..


In a nutshell, both Jon AND Sarine rolled a natural 20, while Warrel and Sara rolled a natural 1.

At the same time.

Astronomical odds of reoccurance, even given improved odds to Jon and Sarine.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2006 10:57 pm 
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Zherical wrote:
normalphil wrote:
Note that Sarine's Alpha-strike from out of blade-range with total tactical surprise was one of the least effective moves of the fight. And Warrel certainly made enough cuts to kill off an entire squad. Numbers and tactical variables might not be all that decisive. Nah, I'm converting to and advocating the viewpoint that Sarine and Jon burned up all outstanding Karma from 3030-odd cumulative years of nice-guy assassin behavior. Highest attainable skill in their chosen vocation causing them to be in a position to benefit from a massive windfall of luck. Non-duplicatable feat given identical or even improved conditions.


What? I've understood every post except this..


Ok then...

Alpha-Strike: Call it an all-out attack. There's more to it, but Errant Story doesn't have giant robots anyway. Tsuiraku seem to field military golems, but the one we've seen was only 10 feet tall, tops. Heck, probably wasn't even ferro-fibrous.

Tactical Surprise (Total): She caught them with their pants down. Flat-footed... damn, I'm going to have to write up another one of these, aren't I?

Numbers and tactical variables: Either having more people to try to kill monks with, or starting in a really, really good situation when you try to kill monks.

Karma: In this context, the belief that providence is finite and alotted to people based on their actions.

Highest attainable skill in their chosen vocation: A person being as good as it is possible to get at their job. For Jon and Sarine, their jobs are to go around killing people. They are very, very good at this.

To be in a position to benefit from a massive windfall of luck: Robert Heinlien wrote in his novel "Have Spacesuit, Will Travel" that cases of good luck are essentially when skilled, prepared people by virtue of being skilled and prepared are able to capitalize on extraordinary circumstances. In this case, Jon was able to survive Warrel's initial attack and brainstorm effective tactics used later in the fight due to Warrel's extraordinary constraint of not being able to kill Jon, only subdue him. Sarine was able to overcome massive injuries and make a decisive strike during a fleeting moment of oppurtunity due to Warrel's inability to see her as a dangerous opponent to be killed quickly, instead seeing her appaerently as a co-participant in an extended snuff-scene.

Non-duplicatable feat given identical or even improved conditions: Nine times out of ten, given the exact same set-up, it won't play out how it just did. Heck, ten times out of ten. Even if you add people to the side fighting the monks, or give them a better starting situation.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2006 10:58 pm 
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I dunno what's worse, me not understanding an english version,

or me understanding a vague D&D D20 reference :D

Thanks aurynn!

@normalphil: It's once you mentioned "highest attainable skill" that I goth thrown off :p


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 03, 2006 7:14 am 
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normalphil wrote:
Chronomancer wrote:
icekatze wrote:
hi hi

Or perhaps the Ensigerum isnt quite so awesome and totally unstoppable as they would like to believe, hence their leader's distaste for their decreased combat prowess. Perhaps that group of wraiths that got slaughtered, died because they panicked.

Who knows? Perhaps we're in for an explanation as soon as they get the heck out of dodge.


Yeah, I'm starting to think the Ensigerum is only at its best when they have the advantage of surprise or during one on one combat. Well, besides Imperatrix who practices against groups. Either way, I think whatever they do takes a LOT of focus so they're at their worst when they are either distracted or don't expect something coming.

As far as Sara, either she is
a) having some sort of internal struggle that's slowing her down
b) still a n00b in the Ensigerum and isn't as good as I thought (although she probably has a LOT of promise)


Note that Sarine's Alpha-strike from out of blade-range with total tactical surprise was one of the least effective moves of the fight. And Warrel certainly made enough cuts to kill off an entire squad. Numbers and tactical variables might not be all that decisive. Nah, I'm converting to and advocating the viewpoint that Sarine and Jon burned up all outstanding Karma from 3030-odd cumulative years of nice-guy assassin behavior. Highest attainable skill in their chosen vocation causing them to be in a position to benefit from a massive windfall of luck. Non-duplicatable feat given identical or even improved conditions.


It's not a total tactical surprise when someone warns them.

But, minor points aside, I agree that luck had a lot to do with it. Just not all luck. I think they have their minor flaws.


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