ZOMBIE FORUMS

It's a stinking, shambling corpse grotesquely parodying life.
It is currently Mon Oct 23, 2017 2:43 am

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]




Forum locked This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 42 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
Author Message
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2007 2:06 pm 
Offline
Addict

Joined: Wed Dec 31, 1969 5:00 pm
Posts: 3759
Location: your house, your living room, your sofa
I suppose I'm just wary to judge anyone who would abandon a child. Of course individuals do exist in society who are exactly the kind of people who are capable of callously and thoughtlessly abusing and misstreating their children - I've been associated with any number of people who have either been the purpotrators or victims of such actions - but without firther information of on the situation of the family ivolved it's difficult to call down a judgement.

Of course it's possible that this was merely a heartless action. It's possible that the father of the child saw a convinient out from unwanted parental responsibility and acted selfishly. But it's also possible that this was an action taken for entirely different and far more complex reasons than simply 'bad parenting'.

Who knows?

The fact is that if you're correct and this was simply an act of selfish asshattery the guy needs a short and violent instructional course on what it means to be man. But what if you're not?

How do you pass judgement on any situtation when you don't know so few of the details?

_________________
Where in the name of Deus Ex Machina did that T-Rex come from?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2007 2:25 pm 
Offline
Native
User avatar

Joined: Fri Oct 31, 2003 2:55 pm
Posts: 562
Location: The Land Of Chainsaw, Rusty City. 187 Blood Blvd, to be specific. Vict-.. err.. visitors welcome.
I must concede to your point of view on this. I am, perhaps, a touch too sensitive to potential child abandonment and/or abuse, considering the sheer number of nephews and nieces I have and a woefully idiotic sister who's significant other I very much desire to do extraordinarily unpleasant things to, as he's made me, as of late, quite a touch more venomous than I usually am. You could say that I too, have born witness to such... unpleasantness.

Perhaps it was such a case for this man as you suggest, having had no choice but to give up his child... An anonymous yet perfectly safe drop off does seem as if it would be less... painful, than approaching the japanese equivalent of a child services office/orphanage or what have you. Really, for such a person who is forced to undertake such an action, who can truly say what would drive them to come to such an agonizing conclusion?

In any case, I must admit that I find myself quite interested in learning any more particulars of this case... though from what I understand of japanese media, the very particulars that I am interested in, i.e. the motivation of such an individual, may very well be withheld from the news in order to protect the identity of the child involved.

_________________
Torture is my Kung Fu, and it is strong.

Initiated by Chaz via Horny Orcish Horde.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2007 3:12 pm 
Offline
Addict

Joined: Wed Dec 31, 1969 5:00 pm
Posts: 3759
Location: your house, your living room, your sofa
I fear you may be right with that last point. The japanese media certainly seems to be more restricted in it's regard to minors than the west is. For example look at the case of Nevada-Tan - not even internet detectives can find anything regarding her true identity save for a few grainy pictures that in many cases may not even be her.

I have a feeling that this case may remain somewhat of mystery.

_________________
Where in the name of Deus Ex Machina did that T-Rex come from?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2007 3:57 pm 
Offline
Native
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2005 5:55 pm
Posts: 715
Location: Brill, Tirisfal Glades
onion wrote:


*unzips*

_________________
Brraaaiiiinnnnnzzzzzz...


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2007 5:07 pm 
Offline
Addict

Joined: Wed Dec 31, 1969 5:00 pm
Posts: 3759
Location: your house, your living room, your sofa
Yorik wrote:
onion wrote:


*unzips*


Yeah.

Okay.

Thanks for joining in with the discussion.

Your input has not been appreciated.

_________________
Where in the name of Deus Ex Machina did that T-Rex come from?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2007 5:58 pm 
Offline
Addict

Joined: Fri Jan 10, 2003 5:00 pm
Posts: 1653
Location: UrAnus
My issues are this
"I was going to put my kid up for adoption because I'm such a waste of life but I don't feel like doing all that paperwork so I'll just put the baby in a drop box"

"I'm a catholic priest and an old Japanese man, theres no way I'de be a pedophile so please drop off your newborns here where no one will ever miss them. I wont abuse them, promise"


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2007 7:21 pm 
Offline
Local
User avatar

Joined: Sat Oct 14, 2006 10:11 am
Posts: 304
Location: The South...
On one hand, it is a genuine way to stop people from creating "dumpster babies". If you had a place you knew your unwanted baby would be cared for, it'd be a lot better than throwing it away in some dark alley for it to die. However, one would have to worry that it is an encouragement of giving away your baby -- an easy out. How many people will come back begging to have their child again?

On the other hand, it seems like an abomination. Drop-off boxes for babies? What's next -- an overnight deposit for your elderly relatives you just can't look after? It's like some futuristic horror movie playing out in real life where babies are just dropped off in boxes and shipped to godknowswhere. How about when the kid grows up and finds out he was a "drop-box baby"? That his mother and/or father didn't want him so badly, they couldn't be bothered with child services and instead dropped him in a box.

I'm mostly against this, and I sincerely hope the Japanese people will find their sense of moral outrage and put a stop to it. Implement some probably needless parental policing programs, have drop-in visits on new parents to make sure they can handle, have whatever stops you from having a baby drop-box.

_________________
***Kitty says, "Rawr".***


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2007 11:43 pm 
Offline
Native
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2005 5:55 pm
Posts: 715
Location: Brill, Tirisfal Glades
onion wrote:
Yorik wrote:
onion wrote:


*unzips*


Yeah.

Okay.

Thanks for joining in with the discussion.


No problem.

_________________
Brraaaiiiinnnnnzzzzzz...


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat May 26, 2007 12:13 am 
Offline
Native
User avatar

Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2004 11:09 pm
Posts: 555
Location: Ziapangu
Speaking as someone who actually lives over here and knows the culture...

onion wrote:
It's deffinitely a completely japanese idea


Yes, because the equivalent acts of anonymously dropping off babies and even older children on the steps of orphanages, churches and other places that are known to take them in and look after them never happened in the West. Also, please note that the hospital in question is a Christian hospital (i.e., run by or affiliated with a Western church).

bellofthedamned wrote:
Drop-off boxes for babies? What's next -- an overnight deposit for your elderly relatives you just can't look after?


Hm... you might want to see what you can find on the subject of "Obasute-yama" (literally: "grandmother-discard-mountain").*

Oh, wait- damn... Sparta.
Looks like the West beat Japan to that, too.


* This is from a few hundred years ago, and is of course no longer practiced today, but given Japan's severely aging population and low birth rate, barring mass immigration (heh) or import of elderly care staff, you never know...


bellofthedamned wrote:
I'm mostly against this, and I sincerely hope the Japanese people will find their sense of moral outrage and put a stop to it. Implement some probably needless parental policing programs, have drop-in visits on new parents to make sure they can handle, have whatever stops you from having a baby drop-box.


Absolutely, because abandonment and other forms of parental irresponsibility and abuse happen so much less in the West. :-?
Seriously, where do people get off subjectively ragging about "moral outrages" in other countries when similar or worse things are happening in their own?

*sigh*

Sarcasm aside, I am against the abandonment of older children such as the toddler in the story, and think that the father/family should be found and at the very least receive counseling, if not punishment. However, I have mixed feelings about the box itself, since it has both the potential for abuse and also the potential to save lives. (Just like so many things in this little world of ours) I would probably have to say I lean in favor of it since given the culture and the people, it will probably be used more responsibly and sparingly than in just about any other country in the world. At any rate, it is a solely Japanese issue, and you can rest assured that the Japanese people and media are scrutinizing and debating it in enough depth that there is really no need for proxy soul-searching by holier-than-thou foreigners.

_________________
Democracy is not liberty. It is majority rule, which is mob rule. We live in a Mobocracy.

"Political power is the game of playing God. It changes a person and makes him different from the rest of us. He begins to believe he has some kind of right to interfere in the lives of others. He may even believe he has the right to choose who lives and who dies."
— Richard Maybury


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat May 26, 2007 2:14 am 
Offline
Addict

Joined: Wed Dec 31, 1969 5:00 pm
Posts: 3759
Location: your house, your living room, your sofa
KirimaNagi wrote:
onion wrote:
Speaking as someone who actually lives over here and knows the culture...

It's deffinitely a completely japanese idea


Yes, because the equivalent acts of anonymously dropping off babies and even older children on the steps of orphanages, churches and other places that are known to take them in and look after them never happened in the West. Also, please note that the hospital in question is a Christian hospital (i.e., run by or affiliated with a Western church).


The context I meant this in was not 'OH LOL JAPAN IS WEIRD'. What I was getting at is that the practicle, sensible no fuss approach to the issue at hand seems to be handled with a deffinitively more eastern approach than say, it would be in the west where there would in all likelyhood, be far more moral uproar at the very idea of it. Over here we would have heard about this idea when it was picketed by local crazies at the very begining, before the box had been installed and well before anyone ever got the chance to drop off any sort of child in it. And to clarify, I'm not saying that's because we're so much more morally superior in the west. It's because we're culturally different.

I'm certainly not being 'holier than thou'. True, I don't understand the culture as well as you might but I hardly think that name calling is particularly useful in this situation. If you want to make a point maybe you should try approaching your topic without sarcasm and personal attacks.

I don't believe at any point I stated that child abandonment doesn't happen outside of Japan. I don't in fact believe I made comparisons of the two.

Perhaps if you want to call anyone holier than thou you might want to look at yourself and the preaching you appear to be doing to people who actually only want to understand the situation better. How about next time you actually try to explain rather than making a lot of :rolleyes: replies to quotes and name calling.

_________________
Where in the name of Deus Ex Machina did that T-Rex come from?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat May 26, 2007 1:31 pm 
Offline
Expatriate
User avatar

Joined: Mon Oct 30, 2006 4:09 pm
Posts: 110
KirimaNagi wrote:
Speaking as someone who actually lives over here and knows the culture...

onion wrote:
It's deffinitely a completely japanese idea


Yes, because the equivalent acts of anonymously dropping off babies and even older children on the steps of orphanages, churches and other places that are known to take them in and look after them never happened in the West. Also, please note that the hospital in question is a Christian hospital (i.e., run by or affiliated with a Western church).


bellofthedamned wrote:
I'm mostly against this, and I sincerely hope the Japanese people will find their sense of moral outrage and put a stop to it. Implement some probably needless parental policing programs, have drop-in visits on new parents to make sure they can handle, have whatever stops you from having a baby drop-box.


Absolutely, because abandonment and other forms of parental irresponsibility and abuse happen so much less in the West. :-?
Seriously, where do people get off subjectively ragging about "moral outrages" in other countries when similar or worse things are happening in their own?



All right, you seem to be arguing that the Western world is equally guilty of the kind of moral lassitude that some think is necessary to conceive of such a device, and that abandonment of children is just as common if not more so in Western society than it is in Japan. Correct me if I misunderstood anything.


KirimaNagi wrote:
At any rate, it is a solely Japanese issue, and you can rest assured that the Japanese people and media are scrutinizing and debating it in enough depth that there is really no need for proxy soul-searching by holier-than-thou foreigners.


Wait, what? Have you forgotten that in the earlier portion of your post, you deny at length Onion's statement that "it's definitely a completely japanese idea"? By what stretch of the imagination do you propose the 'baby drop box' to be something relevant only to the Japanese, given your own claims about similar causative conditions in Western culture? "Because they actually implemented it before anyone else did" is not a valid answer. If the reasons behind the implementation of this concept exist in our own countries, I think that gives us more than enough reasons to debate it's validity.

Really, there's no reason to be so rude and angry if you're just going to contradict yourself.

_________________
'Remember: no matter where you go, there you are!'


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat May 26, 2007 2:30 pm 
Offline
Addict
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 1:34 am
Posts: 2715
Location: Podunk, MI
bellofthedamned wrote:
I think diamonds should move aside --- the baby drop-box is a girl's best friend.


For some reason, I saw this when I read that. I smirked.

_________________
"Oh, look who it is / It's my supportive wife/ And she thinks she's going to squeal/ Hey where do you think you're going?/ Don't you walk away from me/ You put down that telephone /You're not calling anyone"


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat May 26, 2007 8:01 pm 
Offline
Addict
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 12, 2006 12:42 pm
Posts: 1012
Location: Indiana Spaceport
KirimaNagi wrote:
lots of trying to shoot down peoples comments

Ya okay bud. But really the 'question' of whether this is a 'Japanese Idea' is stupid. While I can't say what onion meant, how I took it was that only Japan would have the type of (in my view) rediculously shamed based culture that a baby drop-box would be concieved, first.

Anyway...

The box is a good idea, but I think it could be seriously improved, I mean what about the babie's health records, name, birth certificate(I dont know if japan does that i'm just guessing). I would think that there would be someone to take basic information because what happens if the baby is allergic to penisilen and for some reason it gets injected with it, no medical records and bam deada baby.

I dunno, I hope I contributed an idea.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat May 26, 2007 11:02 pm 
Offline
Native
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2005 5:55 pm
Posts: 715
Location: Brill, Tirisfal Glades
It's not like babies are born carrying a list of their allergies with them.

_________________
Brraaaiiiinnnnnzzzzzz...


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2007 12:41 am 
Offline
Native
User avatar

Joined: Fri Oct 31, 2003 2:55 pm
Posts: 562
Location: The Land Of Chainsaw, Rusty City. 187 Blood Blvd, to be specific. Vict-.. err.. visitors welcome.
Kaz*CheesyDoritoBomb* wrote:
The box is a good idea, but I think it could be seriously improved, I mean what about the babie's health records, name, birth certificate(I dont know if japan does that i'm just guessing). I would think that there would be someone to take basic information because what happens if the baby is allergic to penisilen and for some reason it gets injected with it, no medical records and bam deada baby.

I dunno, I hope I contributed an idea.


I imagine that the inclusion of such vital information may very likely be a prerequisite for using the drop-off point. However, I also assume that the medical information of said child can conceivably be looked up via his/her footprint, though that's only if identification via footprint is practice used in Japan. However, that particular method was in 1988 proven woefully inadequate in actually identifying infants in such a manner by 89%, if I'm not mistaken, though that could easily be due to the fact that hospital personnel simply aren't as good at taking prints as your typical forensics law-enforcement officer. Of course, hospital staff could be a good deal more skilled at it by now.

Fingerprinting is a possibility, but I imagine that's just as difficult if not more so, as tiny as your average infant's fingertips are. There's also DNA genotyping, but that's ludicrously expensive and time-consuming.

_________________
Torture is my Kung Fu, and it is strong.

Initiated by Chaz via Horny Orcish Horde.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2007 5:59 am 
Offline
Addict
User avatar

Joined: Wed May 01, 2002 5:00 pm
Posts: 2885
Location: San Antonio
Gias wrote:
Kaz*CheesyDoritoBomb* wrote:
The box is a good idea, but I think it could be seriously improved, I mean what about the babie's health records, name, birth certificate(I dont know if japan does that i'm just guessing). I would think that there would be someone to take basic information because what happens if the baby is allergic to penisilen and for some reason it gets injected with it, no medical records and bam deada baby.

I dunno, I hope I contributed an idea.


I imagine that the inclusion of such vital information may very likely be a prerequisite for using the drop-off point. However, I also assume that the medical information of said child can conceivably be looked up via his/her footprint, though that's only if identification via footprint is practice used in Japan. However, that particular method was in 1988 proven woefully inadequate in actually identifying infants in such a manner by 89%, if I'm not mistaken, though that could easily be due to the fact that hospital personnel simply aren't as good at taking prints as your typical forensics law-enforcement officer. Of course, hospital staff could be a good deal more skilled at it by now.

Fingerprinting is a possibility, but I imagine that's just as difficult if not more so, as tiny as your average infant's fingertips are. There's also DNA genotyping, but that's ludicrously expensive and time-consuming.


I hope we can come up with better scanning and recognition software now than nearly 20 years ago.

_________________
We used to play for silver, Now we play for life.
One's for sport and one's for blood
At the point of a knife, Now the die is shaken
Now the die must fall,
There ain't a winner in this game
Who don't go home with all, Not with all...


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2007 12:49 pm 
Offline
Addict
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2004 10:31 pm
Posts: 1496
Location: Seattle, Washington
Edit: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article1572569.ece[/url]

_________________
http://www.ericaenns.com
http://spools.comicgen.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jun 02, 2007 2:01 am 
Offline
Native
User avatar

Joined: Fri Oct 31, 2003 2:55 pm
Posts: 562
Location: The Land Of Chainsaw, Rusty City. 187 Blood Blvd, to be specific. Vict-.. err.. visitors welcome.
Spools wrote:
Edit: A link


......

Ah, I've missed this sensation. The sensation of my faith in the rest of humanity dropping at terminal velocity to leave an impact crater the size of a lake. Though to be fair, it hasn't been more than knee-high at best for the past ten years or so.

_________________
Torture is my Kung Fu, and it is strong.

Initiated by Chaz via Horny Orcish Horde.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jun 02, 2007 3:13 am 
Offline
PostWhorePornStar
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 30, 2003 2:17 pm
Posts: 5981
Location: Around about there.
I lolled at the creepy christian comments that people have appended to that article.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jun 02, 2007 1:59 pm 
Offline
PostWhorePornStar
User avatar

Joined: Sat Apr 13, 2002 5:00 pm
Posts: 10543
Location: Bris-Vegas Australia
I need a girlfriend in Japan so I can use this facility.
Failing that I'll get some old Cabbage Patch Dolls and test just how lifelike they really are.

Actor.

_________________
"Why can't we go back to living like cavemen? I know it was a rough and ready existence - the men where always rough and the women were always ready! " - Santa.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Forum locked This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 42 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group