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PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2004 8:52 pm 
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Who's retarded again?

Objective = subjective, then, lets just drop the whole science thing, it is no better than a shaman chanting after all. Works better? Lies, I say the shaman's chants does more etc etc.

End result: I refuse to debate with someone who doesn't exist.

-MiB

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2004 8:56 pm 
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The Man In Black wrote:
Objective = subjective, then, lets just drop the whole science thing, it is no better than a shaman chanting after all. Works better? Lies, I say the shaman's chants does more etc etc.


Image

What are you talking about? Who the said anything about objective reality equalling subjective reality?


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2004 9:33 pm 
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Then you're not making sense. If objectivity has a value above subjectivity, you can start a moral system from there.

-MiB

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2004 10:20 pm 
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The Man In Black wrote:
Then you're not making sense. If objectivity has a value above subjectivity, you can start a moral system from there.

-MiB


Okay, I think I finally sort of understand what you're saying. And my suspiscions of fucktardity are confirmed. Saying two things are equal in value and saying that two things are equal period are two different things. The phrase "all men are created equal" does not mean that every man equals every single other man in every detail. It means all men are valued equally. So if you're trying to say I think objectivity and subjectivity are the same thing, then you're wrong.

If you're trying to say that I think objectivity has the same "objective" value as subjectivity, you're also wrong. I don't think "objective" value exists. I think all values have to be by nature subjective. Saying that it's impossible to compare any two things in objective value is vastly different han saying two things are equal in objective value.

As for whether objectivity is better than subjectivity, it's "better" in the same way that an orgasm is better than a smack upside the head. Or, rather, most people tend to value acting in ways that correspond to "objective" reality in the same way most people tend to value an orgasm. Does everyone like orgasming? Does everyone like the results of paying attention to the objective world? Probably not, but the vast majority, including and most importantly myself, do.

Also, saying that you can start with ONE SINGLE proposition (i.e. that objectivity>subjectivity) and then derive a whole system from it (i.e. an objective system of ethics) is blatantly Cartesian*. I'd like to see you try, honestly, because you'll fail, miserably.


*"Cartesian" is a technical philosophical word for "totally retarded".


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2004 11:16 pm 
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Woah, you've taken an awful lot of space to say "I know more than you, shut up."

I know this is just a forum for intellectual masturbation and all, but please hide it a bit better than that in the future.

As to your points...uh...what points? I see "this is this because I say so!" You're acting as if your points are self-evident (ie all values have to be subjective), in which case you'd be right...but suppose I don't feel like playing the game in your court and say "prove it"?

Wait, that assumes a prover, and as we all know you don't actually exist, you're just the synthesis of a bunch of insecurities and pseudophilosophical bullshit along with a rudimentry chat program designed by Grey.

-MiB

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2004 11:39 pm 
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The Man In Black wrote:
I don't know what I'm talking about, so I'm just going to drop any semblance of addressing your points, make no attempt to understand what you've written, and simply attack you for actually thinking your ideas through thoroughly.


Well, okay then.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 12, 2004 5:19 am 
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Better get forevergrey and cennwood in here to be the voices of reason or things will get immature....

How does a discussion of ethics starting with a quote from Descartes end in:

CHOKE ON MY COCK YOU MEWLING EXCUSE FOR A RETARDED BABOON!

OH YES!? GO SKULLFUCK YOURSELF YOU CARTESIAN WANKER!!!!


Actually this is how philosophical and theological debates usually end, Luther and Zwingli nearly had a knife fight over the sacrament of Communion.

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At the point of a knife, Now the die is shaken
Now the die must fall,
There ain't a winner in this game
Who don't go home with all, Not with all...


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 13, 2004 7:22 pm 
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Yeahhh...could I stop getting lumped with grey, please? I depise the man, and unlike him, I actually read peoples posts, and only flame when someone starts flaming me or acting like a bigot.

Anyway, if Iam the voice of reason here, then Icymonkey has a point with his last post. When only one person is attempting to continue the conversation by understanding the other person points, its time to give it up. I expect grey will sense the danger to his "big dog" and jump in to sidetrack the conversation with some dumbass picture and a few retarded insults.

Honestly, is there no way to have an intelligent conversation on this forum without it turning into a flame war/pissing contest? I think Ill stick to http://xforums.net for any conversation that'll make me think.

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I came to see the CIRCUS, not some half dressed tart spouting dire warnings. -BG2, Shadows of Amn


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