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 Post subject: Reflections upon seeing "Superman Returns"
PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2006 11:03 am 
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Last night, I sat through the new film "Superman Returns". It was probably a pretty good film, for its type, but I came out depressed. Brandon Routh, the actor who played Clark Kent aka Superman, just wasn't Superman.

The film does continue in canon. They've reused sets, music, and the voice of Marlon Brando as Jor-el. They went to some lengths to explain why there hasn't been a Superman film in a long time. If the film weren't in the canon of the previous films, I would not have been writing this, but as it stands, Brandon Routh just wasn't Superman.

And it's not his fault.

Many actors have played the role of James Bond, in the continuing series. Many actors played the role of Batman, for that matter. We don't say, "George Clooney wasn't Batman", though, we say, "George Clooney was so bad at being Batman that he ruined the franchise." Besides, Brandon Routh's acting ability is not what I'm talking about.

There will only ever be one film Superman for me, and that's Christopher Reeve. He was not a superb actor, but he definitely looked the part. He even acted it to an extent, off screen; he was a good, generous, decent man. Jor-el sent his son Kal-el to Earth because we humans have at least a touch of goodness and greatness in us, and Christopher Reeve partook of that touch. But, sadly for him, he had the truly appalling luck to sever his spinal cord in a fall from a horse.

And he wanted to walk again! He wanted it so. He knew there was a hope he might have been able to. Quadruplegics like him have very short expected life spans, but there was a chance for him in stem-cell research, had it been continued. It was not. The interests of microscopic bits of fast-reproducing protoplasm were placed ahead of the interest of Christopher Reeve and unknown others of other people who have nervous damage.

Stem cells aren't people. Stem cells are just stem cells. Experimenting upon them is not equivalent to experimenting upon people. People who have radical nervous damage, like Christopher Reeve, are nevertheless people. Not all people have the charisma of a Christopher Reeve, or the acknowledged wealth, but not all of us have the decency either; and yet, all of us are very vulnerable to spinal injury. Learning to coax stem cells to become new nervous tissue would benefit everyone.

If Christopher Reeve were alive today, he would be much too old for the part of Superman, and I'd have enjoyed the film anyway, knowing that the torch had been passed to Brandon Routh, who is also a so-so actor who looks the part. He's not, though.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2006 9:52 pm 
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Christopher Reeve was no god. He was just a rich motherfucker who was dumb enough to spook his horse as he was riding around his massive property, and got a broken neck as a result. He then spent massive amounts of money of a PR campaign, and on research for purely selfish reasons. He wanted to walk. So does every other quadra- and paraplegic in the country.

Adult stem cells aren't people, no. Fetal stems cells aren't people, but you have to kill someone to make them. That is the difference.


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2006 10:09 pm 
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nick012000 wrote:
Fetal stems cells aren't people, but you have to kill someone to make them.

Just the way this is worded screams 'logic fallacy!', but I'm not sure which one.


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2006 11:25 pm 
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Nick, not only are there are myriad ways to end a pregnancy, but the fetuses slated to be used for stem cell research were leftovers from in vitro. They were destroyed anyway when the federal government decided that they couldn't be used for stem cell research.

The only possible difference in terms of a "body count" between adult stem cell research and fetal stem cell research is all the people you aren't saving by using the more limited adult stem cells.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2006 11:54 pm 
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They were destroyed anyway? Then the people responsable should get murder charges pressed.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:49 pm 
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They were blastocytes. Balls of less than 100 cells. They were also fertilized outside of the womb, and beyond a costly implant procedure they would have never become humans at all.

That would be the most rediculous murder charge ever.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:55 pm 
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In the responsibility-free get-rich-quick world where people sue over the most idiotic things and win, it would not be surprising.

Damn you, McDonalds coffee woman. Damn you to hell.


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 4:15 pm 
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Kestenvarn wrote:
In the responsibility-free get-rich-quick world where people sue over the most idiotic things and win, it would not be surprising.

Damn you, McDonalds coffee woman. Damn you to hell.


Absurd, yes. However, there was a valid point there- the heat of the coffee was far above normal drinking temperatures. The reason for that was due to the fact that you can get far more coffee per bean at higher temperatures- this is the idea behind espresso, except with enough liquid to actually make it coffee as opposed to concentrated hate. XD

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 4:54 pm 
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That case only sounds silly on the surface; she really did have a valid complaint. Coffee should not give you third-degree burns.

Edit-fu:
Despite these extensive injuries, she offered to settle with McDonald’s for $20,000. However, McDonald’s refused to settle. The jury awarded Liebeck $200,000 in compensatory damages -- reduced to $160,000 because the jury found her 20 percent at fault -- and $2.7 million in punitive damages for McDonald’s callous conduct.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 4:59 pm 
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Not really debating that point, just seems like she paved the way for these other bozos. (Like the truck driver that tried to sue the city when he backed into his own car. Of course, he left out who happened to be driving the truck...)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 5:02 pm 
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McDonald's was the one too stupid to settle. :)

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 6:08 pm 
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Actually, there's absolutely no reason whatsoever we couldn't have stem cells coming out our ears for stem cell research. A fresh stem cell line for each and every researcher, research intern, and janitor in a research lab that wanted to do stem cell research. You don't just have to destroy a zygote, blastocyte, or whatever to get them.

Umbilical cord blood is repleat with stem cells, they're just a little more labour intensive to get at them, but there are more of them to get at as well. All we would need to do is automaticly harvest the umbilical cord blood from any healthy birth and whenever a new SC line is called for, just reach back into the freezer and thaw one out.

The only roadblock is that what should be a purely scientific research matter has become a political football for the ignorant but zealous. It would also be hampered by the acquisitive and proprietary nature of human beings. If you're gonna use my baby's cord blood for stem cell research that leads to highly lucrative discoveries, I want my cut, damnit! There's also privacy implications. If you have my baby's stem cells to play genetic soccer with, then you also are able to learn more about me than perhaps I'm willing to have divulged.

Frankly, I'd like to see a policy similar to that employed in France for organ transplant purposes. In America, in order for a dead person's organs to be harvested, he must have given positive prior consent. In France, organ donation is the default state. In France, in order to prevent your organs from being donated upon your death, you must have given prior dissent to the procedure. If neither parent in a successful live birth has checked the "I dissent to have my baby's cord blood banked for stem cell research purposes" box, then it should happen automaticly, but with but the barest hints of the gene pools from which that infant's stem cells draw their DNA.

Hmmm, that could also be problematic where the parent(s) geneology is in question, either adoptees or Father: Unknown situations. Meh, I'll let the bioethicists hash that one out.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 9:15 pm 
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People who complain about these fetuses getting destroyed and calling it murder confuse the dog-ball fuck out of me. Same with abortion. Unless it can open it's eyes at me and communicate in the simplest way--a middle finger, screaming, making grabbing motions at tits 'cause it's thirsty--it doesn't count as being alive.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 9:16 pm 
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It will be, though, and that's what counts.


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 Post subject: Caught you!
PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 4:03 am 
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nick012000 wrote:
It won't be since they are destroyed anyways, though, and that's what counts.

Aha.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 5:30 am 
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As soon as the sperm hits the egg, and the egg starts dividing, a new human life starts. Killing it at any point afterwards is murder. Keeping it in indefinite cryogenic stasis is fine, because it might be unfrozen and implanted at some future time.


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 Post subject: I'm not sure what it would take to have someone agree with you here. It's kinda of an old subject for this forum.
PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 6:00 am 
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Yes, yes. You keep repeating that, but it's not getting anyone to agree with you on its own.

:-?


Last edited by Kest on Sat Jul 15, 2006 6:03 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 6:02 am 
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I doubt it would. It all ultimately comes down to personal ethics.


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 9:50 am 
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Of which you have shown you have none of.

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 11:11 am 
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